Character Analysis of Jack Twist

[fofol]

  As a toddler, Jack was taught by his father that he has little to no worth as a person.  He needs reassurance that he has value, is wanted.  Ennis, due completely to his own childhood trauma, is unable to supply this reassurance - he held him once, didn't he?  When Jack can't/doesn't get what Ennis can't give, he gets it from other men.  As janjo states in her last post, what we call this is entirely up to our point of view.

[janjo]

Although, as I feel sure you know, I am no prude, I tend not to think that rampant promiscuity is good for body or soul, however, in a lifetime a certain amount of sleeping around is perfectly reasonable depending on the circumstances.
IMO Jack had just cause for his transgressions.

[royandronnie]

I don't know about promiscuous--I don't really think so, though to some degree it depends on what your definition of the word is--but when Jack says "…and tell me you'll kill me for needin somethin I don't hardly never get," I think he's talking about what he hardly never gets from Ennis. This is not to say he doesn't get it regularly; but obviously, whether he does or doesn't is irrelevant: it's Ennis he wants it from, and hardly ever gets it from.

Still, it seems to me that while he is explicitly talking about sex, what he really means is companionship and togetherness--love. He gets a very little of it, and goes to Mexico to try and simulate it with paid sex. I don't think it's ever intended that we think Jack's a horndog who's only interested in how much sex he can have, regardless of whom it's with.

[Desecra]

I think "promiscuous" is a bit of a loaded word.  It's seen as a "bad thing".   And where is the line crossed - where does it change from being a natural, healthy expression of sexuality to promiscuity?  I believe Jack was sexually active, but I don't think the actual number of partners he had is very relevant.   The issue is about him wanting any male partners at all, not the number. 

[fofol]

I think "promiscuous" is a bit of a loaded word.  It's seen as a "bad thing".   And where is the line crossed - where does it change from being a natural, healthy expression of sexuality to promiscuity?  I believe Jack was sexually active, but I don't think the actual number of partners he had is very relevant.   The issue is about him wanting any male partners at all, not the number.  

    This is all true, provided you're not the partner of the guy who's sleeping around, not rolling his own...  How many extra-marital sexual encounters does it take to make a married man promiscuous?  Not saying they're 'married,' I'm just framing the question a touch differently, for perspective purposes.

[royandronnie]

But this is a special circumstance, I think: they live 1200 miles apart, and that's not the doing of the partner who's getting it elsewhere. You are to some extent framing this as an issue of fidelity, but I think large drivers of the Mexico trips are despair, and punishment, both of Jack and Ennis--maybe more than actual need for sex.

[Desecra]

I agree that it's not a fidelity issue.   They never make any agreement, spoken or otherwise, to be "faithful".  Realistically, how many people would swear a partner to fidelity if they only saw them for a few days once or twice a year?    It's stretching the limits of a long distance relationship.  (I do know some people would.  But some other people would feel they couldn't tie a partner to that).   I don't get the impression that Ennis ever asked that of Jack, or would have done.  They do not live as "married".

They do make a kind of spoken agreement to not be gay, and that's the contract that Jack breaks.  He'd have broken that if had been one guy or a thousand.  (He'd probably have broken it if there hadn't been other guys as long as he'd ever had thoughts about men in general, rather than just Ennis).  There's no point in him making an effort to stay "faithful" or to reduce the number of partners, and it looks like he doesn't particularly try.   It didn't matter if it was one Mexico trip or 20, or 200 - Ennis wasn't going to ask about the numbers, but whether it happened at all.

I think that in the film that solitary trip does look despairing and miserable.  But in the short story I imagined the encounters were fairly normal and enjoyable (as much as they could be when Jack was craving somebody else, and he and his partners were in a homophobic environment with their own varying degrees of repression and fear).   I always thought that "riding more than bulls" (not in the film.  There Jack seems to try to pick somebody up but doesn't succeed) sounded like a fun activity, and Jack had no money - it's not like he'd have been buying sex.   Later, it sounds as if he is buying sex, whether it's through the formal route or spending money on partners, but there's still at least one guy who's up for a more serious relationship (the ranch neighbour).   I think the mystery for Jack is that no matter how good the sex is, how nice the guys are, or how far they want to commit, he still craves Ennis.  

[janjo]

Well said, Des.

[fofol]

Not an issue of fidelity?  When you were looking for a boyfriend, did you stick with the one who was having sex with other women while seeing you?  ... and lying to you about it?   (just asking a question)


    Maybe this is clearer: do we have expectations of fidelity (not can or should we, but do we) only with prior declaration?  Is the hope for fidelity meaningless in a relationship or potential relationship?

[Desecra]

What Jack lies about is not so much infidelity but being attracted to men at all.  They discuss it at the motel in the short story (not the movie).   Ennis talks about thinking of doing it with other men, says he hasn't, and asks Jack if Jack has ever done it with men.  Not whether he might be unfaithful in the future (they haven't even set up their relationship yet), but whether he's done it in the past, even before he met Ennis.   

I don't think my personal experience would be enlightening at all, but yes, I've been in relationships where there was an agreement to be faithful that was broken and also in relationships where there's an agreement to see other people.  (As well as plain old monogamous relationships ).  But I've never been in a relationship where I would expect the person to have never done anything with other women and not be attracted to them, even before we met.

[fofol]

Regarding fidelity, Jack's lie is clearly when he replies to Ennis's direct question if he's doin it with other guys is, "No."  That's unequivocal.  A lie is a lie, there are no excuses that make a lie the truth, unless I'm clueless about this too.

[Desecra]

Yes, we're told directly that it's a lie.  But it can't be about fidelity at that point - they've only just got together again.  (And even after the summer, it was clear that there was no promise of a continuing relationship). 

Ennis explains that he's worked out what he really feels for Jack and why he felt ill at the end of the summer.   He seems to be saying that being attracted to a man means that he could be gay.  However, he says he knows that he isn't and gives some reasons why not, one being that the only man he's thought about having sex with is Jack.     It's in that context that he asks Jack if he's (ever) done it with another man.   The question is really something like "Are you like me, attracted to women but with a thing about one man (i.e. straight) or are you attracted to men in general (gay)?"  And beneath the surface is something like "It's important to me that neither of us are gay.   Please say that you're straight so that we can continue".

[fofol]

Fidelity can be strict compliance with promises or duties, but just as clearly it means loyalty.  I, for one, have never equated a lover's lies with loyalty.  If Jack felt honestly that his behavior was above board, why lie?

[fofol]

Yes, we're told directly that it's a lie.  But it can't be about fidelity at that point - they've only just got together again.  (And even after the summer, it was clear that there was no promise of a continuing relationship). 

Ennis explains that he's worked out what he really feels for Jack and why he felt ill at the end of the summer.   He seems to be saying that being attracted to a man means that he could be gay.  However, he says he knows that he isn't and gives some reasons why not, one being that the only man he's thought about having sex with is Jack.     It's in that context that he asks Jack if he's (ever) done it with another man.   The question is really something like "Are you like me, attracted to women but with a thing about one man (i.e. straight) or are you attracted to men in general (gay)?"  And beneath the surface is something like "It's important to me that neither of us are gay.   Please say that you're straight so that we can continue".

  A man who loves another man - even only one other man - is not straight.

[Desecra]

I think Jack accepts his sexuality more than Ennis, but he doesn't seem proud of it, and Ennis is giving him clues that he (Ennis) doesn't accept it (all the reasons why he isn't gay).   Ideally, Jack should feel able to say something like "I'm gay and you probably are too, and we're in love, so where do we go from here?".  

At that point, there hasn't been a chance for Jack to be unfaithful to Ennis.    Ennis is asking about the past, not whether Jack will sleep with men in the future.  If it was purely about sexual fidelity, and not sexuality, Jack could have said that of course he'd done it with other guys, but now they were together there was no need.  

At that point, they haven't talked about their future together and Jack is still imagining that they will live together.

(Of course Ennis isn't straight.   But he seems able to believe he is, because he's married with a wife and kids and Jack is the only man he's been attracted to.   He gives Jack the message that he wouldn't be happy with Jack admitting he was gay - and he isn't happy when Jack finally admits it.)