Awards Aftermath - Part 2

[suelyblu]

Posted about a program I saw on TV tonight....on the "TV Right Now" thread here. Panel of film critics were asked about travesties of films and actors that should have received Awards but got beat by a much less deserving film.To a man they all said "BBM". They even queried if the Awards panel had even watched it !

[kathy]

So true!  Everyone knows about the travesty that happened; this to me is one of their greatest mistakes, if not the greatest. 
Of course it shouldn't have happened, but considering the membership of the 'ampas' it unfortunately did.

Also, I remember reading several times that a great number of the so-called 'academy's' members  were bragging that they had not seen Brokeback Mountain and had no intention of doing so.  They continued their insider campaign against it.  And not seeing the film is against the rules but what did they care?  Nothing but a bunch of idiots.   

kathy          



 

[morrobay]

anyone know if there's a youtube of Jack Nicholson presenting when Crash won??  supposedly he was shocked to see the card didn't say Brokeback...I've been checking yt, but can't seem to find it...

thanks

[Lyle (Mooska)]

This is the best one I could find:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vM_19Zzs4DU

[morrobay]

thanks, Lyle....

I couldn't get video on that link, only audio...and is "Dirty Laundry" playing in between?

[Lyle (Mooska)]

Hmmm...that's odd.

I googled "worst oscar best picture winners"

Try doing that on the youtube search and see if you get anything else like that maybe...

[kathy]

I could never find a complete video of a shocked Jack Nicholson when he opened that damned envelope.  However, I've read several times that the gasp from the audience was so loud it could have been heard across the street.  

Also, I've read that JN said 's--t' when he opened that envelope.  He said afterwards that he couldn't believe it.  Well, we all know what went on behind the scenes that year.  Homophobia certainly was alive and well in those 'ampas' members and their partners in crime.  What a bunch of bastards.  They took it out on several other nominations was well.   Damn!

kathy  
p.s.  Jack Nicholson's reaction - as well as the reaction of the audience - says it all. Just found the clip.  It's almost unbelievable how asinine those 'ampas members' can be.  Downright mean and prejudiced IMO.      

[Lyle (Mooska)]

Kathy, you know that I agree with you about a streak of homophobia
leading to what happened about BBM, but I cannot, as you seem to
do in your posts, label the whole of ampas in that light.

If you think that there are 5 nominees in each category and that you
could win with as little as 20% + 1 vote. I've long thought that probably
every winner wins with a majority of people having not voted for it! I
know some SAG and BAFTA voters and every year they have voted,
most everything they vote for doesn't win.  (My SAG friend told me
that he only voted for TWO of the winners in this years SAG awards
out of, what, 16 or so categories?!)

I also know that openly gay screenwriter Barry Sandler voted for
Phillip Seymour Hoffman for Best Actor.  He said so in an Advocate
article.  (He voted Brokeback for Best Picture.)  I also know for a fact
that the openly gay writer of the Munich screenplay, Tony Kushner,
voted for Munich for Best Picture.  (I can't fault him for supporting his
own work, even though it was clearly evident Munich would not win.)
I would think neither of those persons are homophobic.

I do think that from all the available data used to prognosticate the
winners from oscars inception and also the way the awards season
played out that year, that the only plausible and logical explanation for
Brokeback Mountain not winning best film from ampas is that "streak
of homophobia" that was evidenced during the voting period and
commented on and written about, even before the awards were given
out, by journalists like Nikki Finke and Tom O'Neill and by a few ampas
members themselves like Tony Curtis, before the awards, and Ernest
Borgnine afterwards.

Believe me, I have thought about this and analyzed it way too much
and come to my conclusion this was the case!  The only way I would
consider changing that conclusion is if the vote totals for each film were
such that it might indicate something else going on, but ampas does
not release that information, although it's highly intriguing to me that
the information IS out there--somewhere--and that some people do
know this info.

The negative audience reaction you referred to in your post (that you
indicate you agreed with) were also ampas members doing that reacting,
so you might want to consider toning down your criticism of the entire
group, because it does a disservice to those who are certainly not all
"bastards" or the like.  In fact, many of those members who voted for
Munich or Good Night and Good Luck, or Capote, might also certainly
have wanted BBM to win over what did, but their voting system was not
like many critics groups that vote and then narrow down the choices
and then vote again.

I am all for condemning that "streak of homophobia" that led to the
outcome we abhor, but as I tried to illustrate above, that is probably
not a majority of the ampas members.

FWIW.

[Lyle (Mooska)]

Kathy, you are right in your other post on BBM General Discussion that
there was indeed info about all the awards BBM won posted in this
thread at some point, but it's not readily accessible since we don't
know where it is, like it would be if it was a kind of factual read only
thread or something.

[kathy]

Lyle:

Thx for the above two posts.  I love paragraphs 4 and 5 in the first one.  True conclusion. 

I think the reason I'm so against (such) ampas members is the blatant, outrageous insider and press campaign that was waged against BBM as Best Picture to the point of bragging they would never even see it and badmouthing it.  I don't know; maybe this proves just how stupid the awards have become and how some of the members really are mean bastards. 
We all know that many asinine 'choices' have been made before that's for sure, but this one goes down in their awards history as the greatest.  They sure know it, we know it, and the whole industry knows it.   

kathy
p.s.  How in all creation could Heath NOT have won Best Actor?  I can say the same for Jake as Best Supp. Actor also...plus the beautiful cinematography, etc., etc.   Oh well, you get my drift.

[Lyle (Mooska)]

I had not seen this before.  It's an oscar related cartoon spoof based on
the 2000 Palm Beach County Florida ballot that was widely seen as losing
Al Gore several thousand votes:

[fritzkep]

Well, that would convince the Supremes.

[Lyle (Mooska)]

Another honor:  The Advocate-45 Years

Our Hall of Fame

Any celebration of the The Advocate's founding in 1967 must honor the heroes
for LGBT rights that we've covered for 45 years. With one honoree named per
year, this is the final installment before a celebration Thursday in Los Angeles.



The gay romance told in Brokeback Mountain was so intimate it almost never got made.
Agents  pushed their actors away from the script.   Common wisdom in Hollywood was
homophobic and  had always assumed  roles like these could derail  promising  careers.
That's why two up-and-coming young actors willing to play the roles of cowboys Ennis
Del Mar and Jack Twist, who were locked in a secret affair in the Wyoming mountains,
were repeatedly called "brave."

The late Heath Ledger and Jake Gyllenhaal were both nominated for Academy Awards
for their performances. The movie was a Best Picture nominee. All of them lost while
Ang  Lee  won  for  Best  Director  and  the screenplay and music took home Oscars.

It's a testament to what they accomplished, though, that the next time a gay
romance comes along with two buzzed about young actors in the lead roles, it's
unlikely the actors will be commended for their courage. --Lucas Grindley 

[kathy]

                                                

[Lyle (Mooska)]

In MY opinion, homophobia was part of the reason Brokeback lost. But not the only one and not the major one. A lot of people... not Oscar voters, just regular people... simply did not like Brokeback. A lot of people didn't want to see it period. And homophobia was not the main reason for either of those. There are way more films that come out every year that I have no desire to see than ones I'd like to. That doesn't mean I have a phobia about or hatred for their subject matter... they're just about something that doesn't interest me or a genre I'm not into.

AMEN to that.   My son and his girlfriend just spent Canada Day at Gay Pride this weekend...........but they did not like Brokeback, just didn't care for it as a movie, no agenda....

You know, these things you guys post about differing opinions are all very well and true, but
they are besides the point when it comes to discussing the reasons why Brokeback Mountain
lost the best picture oscar.

You guys seem to want to gloss over the fact that Brokeback Mountain was all but guarantedd to win
the oscar by every measurable prognostication that can be measured. It was as much a hands down
winner that year as Titanic was in 1997 or Schindler's List was in 1993 or Gone with the Wind was in
1939.  Look at my posts every year since this forum started as to what I predicted would win Best Picture
every year. 100%.

The reason people keep writing about this is that it was a complete aberration.  Not even a surprise.
It was a shock.  And so, people look for a reason why it was an aberratoin.  Why it was a shock.  What
is the only reason that makes any sense for such an outcome that year? A reason that ampas would go
against the resounding opinion of both critics and public?  A reason that cannot be applied to other years
in similar circumstances?  A reason that encompasses why it would break 78 years of every "rule" for oscar
predictions?  Not just one rule or two or three, which happens every year, but ALL of them.  Each and
every single one of them! 

There is a reason that we know every year what is giong to win best picture.  There is a concensus
to it.  And ampas is a very predicatable body when it comes to the best picture winner.  If you don't
believe that then you just don't know the history and workings of ampas, even though I have tried to
clue you in on it ever since this thread started.

If you two want to believe there was no homophobia involved in their decision then you have to
answer this question: What was the reason this outcome absoutely shocked so many people?  And
so shocked them that it hasn't gone away yet.  That it is still written about and talked about every
year since?  Why was this year different than any other and why did it break every single rule that
people have used since oscar history began to divine what would win the best picture award?  What
is the reason that makes the most sense and that cannot be used in other circumstances?

What I ask?

(And why are you both so willing not to believe it? Or make excuses that it isn't true?)